I posted about this same thing about a month and a half ago (the fat getting jigglier). As far as the spare tire thing, maybe i'm really a man, because my thighs have gotten thinner, I can't get rid of MY spare tire...

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I know that it's good for my heart, even if the gut isn't shrinking, and that the gut will go eventually...

As the trainer put it "if I could tell people a way to get rid of the gut first, I'd be a rich man!"

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Oh, did you know that fat cells themselves--lipidocytes--are good for the body, playing a role in the immune system?

By this measure, I should be one of the healthiest people I know! :-}

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as I read it, the fat CELLS never go away (unless you get them physically removed with liposuction).

The fat CELLS actually hold fat, but the fat is not the fat cell...

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I didn't really realize that.

so: fat CELLS good.

fat BAD!

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do you kill them when you lose weight? :)

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o.k., just looked it up (since I didn't think so but couldn't remember)...

No, you don't get more. You get all your fat cells during puberty and once you're past puberty, that's all you get. And they don't ever go away, they just deflate if you loose weight.

Here's an article on how fat cells work and the roll they hold in the body:
http://home.howstuffworks.com/fat-cell.htm

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There is reason to think that this might not be true. People used to think that we had all the brain cells we'd ever have during our lives at birth, and now we know that you can get new nerve cells. [There's some data that says that antidepressants may contribute to the growth of new brain cells.] A recent study (published just last week in a respectable scientific journal whose name escapes me at the moment) showed that mice make new eggs during their lives. We had thought that female mammals have all the eggs they'll ever have from the time that they're born, but that might not be true either.

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Hmmm...interesting. I'd guess though, that these variations might be small fluctuations or increases around a nearly fixed value...

In any event, it's shedding those lipids from the fat cells--however many we have--that's key. A fat cell without fat, I guess, is pretty much just some pretty compact connective tissue.

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actually, my understanding is also that you don't actually "loose" fat cells when you loose weight, they just deflate. but like all cells (except cancer cells)they grow as your body does to a certain point, then they stop multiplying - so when you gain weight you're just adding lipids to the fat cells (as pete said), and the lipids and the expansion of the fat cells themselves is the health problem.

and fat cells are not only important to the immune system, but also (IIRC) to the endocryn and cardiovascular system as well.

and when it comes to dietary fat, fat is necessary to the entire organism... it's the "lubricant" of the system. without it your skin would dry up, your joints wouldn't function properly, etc. so when formulating a healthful diet you have to consider "good fats" vs. "bad fats" just as you must consider "good carbs" vs. "bad carbs" (there's not a lot of "good" or "bad" to protein, just "complete" or "incomplete", which in a balanced diet is pretty much irrelevant, since the body doesn't work with complete proteins anyway, it breaks any protein down into it's composite amino acids and then works with those amino acids to build with.

and when it comes to fats, the "good" dietary fats are those which contain Omega-3 and Omega-6 EFAs (essential fatty acids)- essential to good health and considered to stave off the growth of cancerous cells, such as those obtained from nuts, seeds and fish and those with a higher level of HDL cholestoral vs. LDL cholestoral (HDL is the cholestoral that lubricates your cardiovascular system while LDL is the type of cholestoral is the kind that causes plaque and clogs up your arteries.) "bad" dietary fats are those which are heat processed (like the "hydrogenated" and "partially hydrogenated" oils in margerine and most processed foods) and therefore contain triglycerides and trans-fatty acids, which cause your system to actually *produce* LDL. Which is why any good nutritionist up on current research will tell you to use olive oil and butter and avoid almost all margarines and to take a fish oil supplement unless you eat a good bit of fish, seeds and nuts in your diet.

Here's a good short article on the "good fats vs. bad fats" thing:
<a href="http://www.ivillage.co.uk/dietandfitness/nutrition/fat/qas/0,9582,246_157990,00.html>http://www.ivillage.co.uk/dietandfitness/nutrition/fat/qas/0,9582,246_157990,00.html</a> Nutrition 101 lecture over and out ;-) (You wouldn't know that someone as fat, out of shape and in such a poor state of health would know that, huh!... but having the data is the first step to changing the process for me.) Never Thirst, cat

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oops! guess I messed up on typing in that link...

sorry!
cat

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it looks like it recovered. ;)

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well, it *works*
but it *looks* like crap ;-)
cat

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details details...

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Results from the Framingham Heart Study showed a correlation between people with more LDL having more heart attacks that people who have more HDL. This is why people started labeling LDL as 'bad' and HDL as 'good'. This doesn't mean that HDL is protective against heart attacks, though people certainly hoped that that would be true. A new study (report in today's NYT) shows that angioplasty (cleaning out arteries with tiny balloons) and stents (small wiry tubes to hold open arteries) might not be effective in preventing heart attacks. Many people who have angioplasty & stents have heart attacks anyway. It seemed like a good idea--just clean up the plaque and everything should be fine--but what seems to be most effective is quitting smoking, lowering cholesterol (diet &/or drugs), and doing other boring healthy things.

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I know...doesn't it suck. No magic bullet. And most of my fat is in my gut, which study after study says is the worst kind of fat to have...

So, nothing to it but to actualize the lean, mean, calorie-burning, weight pumping machine within.

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according to several source that I've been reading lately (including the newspaper, online news and several resources on Low Carb/Low GI dieting), there are currently studies going on which are researching raising HDL (including drugs which raise HDL) as a way to prevent heart disease and ways to make LDL particals *larger*, so that they will not add to the plague level. Those are studies in progress, so you don't see much published on them yet. If I can find the specific sources that mentioned them, tho', I'll try and remember to post them, so that you can look them up :-)

But all of this is part of why I always say that nutritional science is always in a state of controversy. there always seem to be battling studies out there stating different things, and it almost takes multiple degrees, in medicine, nutrition, biochemistry and statistics to navigate the mine fields ;-)

I agree with your final statement with one caveat, however... from what I've been reading, research over the last few decades doesn't seem to have demonstrated a corollary between the reduction of dietary fat and the reduction of cholestoral. Whereas studies that have been done on reduced carb diets *do* demonstrate a lowering of blood cholestoral levels, often both LDL and HDL. Which is why I've developed the opinion that low fat diets and reduction of naturally occuring saturated fats, especially in favor of sugar and hydrogenated fats which raise triglyceride levels, are not as healthy as adopting either a whole foods or a reduced carb/reduced GI lifestyle.

And if you *can* do it through diet, that's better than having to take the drugs, IMO, since they have too many side effects and interactions.

Cat

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Oh! One more thing... fat is necessary in some way to the reproductive cycle and plays a part in the menstrual process as well. Female athletes and dancers who reduce their BMI too far can stop menstruating!

Never Thirst,
cat

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umm....not something I'm stressing about here. ;)

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like I said... just "another fat fact". didn't really think you'd have any personal use for that one.

but then, again, perhaps some young lady reading your journal might. i imagine some young lady somewhere might just be reading your journal ;-)

cat

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